Senator Kerry isn't the first person to use the word "quagmire," nor is Iraq the first war to ever have the term applied to it. Your post is typical of the scandal hungry masses who want to read venom against America into everything the left says.

Iraq IS a quagmire. It is the Bush administration which has allowed much of the populated areas to become insurgent controlled "no-go" zones. That's not leftist propaganda. That's from the Pentagon. Is the Pentagon encouraging the deaths of American troops because they concede that insurgents control a lot of the country?

Keep on with the scare tactics. A scared America is a Republican America.

This is one of the saddest posts I've seen yet. The best way to support our troops is to get them out of that QUAGMIRE. Bush is the one who created the QUAGMIRE. Kerry using the word QUAGMIRE does not make him responsible for any deaths. I have written the word QUAGMIRE in your thread four times now. What will you be responsible for?

He is giving the same support to the anti-vote Iraqi regimes today as he gave to the North Vietnamesse 30 years ago. It emboldens the enemy to see our in-fighting and gives them comfort. So the original idea is sound. Does anyone think that the terrorists would vote for Bush? No. They favor Kerry - so causing more deaths in Iraq is the main way they have to influence the voters.

So our thread title: "John Kerry is encouraging the death of Americans in Iraq! " is true. Some day there will be a museum in some radical Iraqi town with his image and words in it, just as thre is today in Viet Nam. He has made himself a hero all over the world. Just not in America - but not for lack of trying. The guy just keeps picking the wrong tree to bark up.

I have to ask, was the use of the word 'quagmire' a translation or was it an English loan word thrown into an Arabic sentence? If it was a translation, then that's more on the translator than on the speaker. I'm not an Arabic linguist, so I couldn't do it myself, but speaking as a Korean linguist, I just checked the dictionary and there are four words listed under 'quagmire' in my English to Korean dictionary. Now, in addition to those, I can think of four or five more words that I could translate from Korean into English as quagmire with the right context. If this is the case, then it's more on how the translator decided to interpret the words - they may have gone with 'quagmire' because of it's recent popularity as a description of Iraq.

If it was a loan word, well, then the source is still difficult at best to pin on Kerry. The word has been used to describe the situation in Iraq by many people, not just Kerry. It's possible that the terrorists were specifically trying to quote Kerry here, but I think that's really a tough sell.

In either case, Kerry himself is not the only person that looks at the handling of Iraq this way. It's difficult to pin this on him alone.

As far as people being divisionist being bad for the situation in Iraq, well, I think that you'd be hard pressed to find an American that was truly against the work that the troops are doing to make Iraq better. You may find people that think they can do it better or be against the reason for going into Iraq in the first place. But I'd say the majority of Americans understand that the troops are doing a good job overall of making the place better and support the troops without supporting the administration that put them there. That's fine with me. I think that if Kerry has a different plan, he owes it to the American people to be honest about what he'd do differently. I don't think that's necessarily divisionist.

I am in no way a Kerry supporter, but I think pinning this act on him doesn't make sense.

What DOES he want to do there? All I have heard is that he wants to get the US out in 6 months and put other nations in. Would someone please detail or link the Kerry recipee for how to handle Iraq '05-'08?

What DOES he want to do there? All I have heard is that he wants to get the US out in 6 months and put other nations in. Would someone please detail or link the Kerry recipee for how to handle Iraq '05-'08

That was part of my point. I think he owes it to the American people to be honest about his plans. Not just 'ask for aid from our international brothers and sisters'. I think he is doing more damage to himself by not doing away with the perception by many people that he has not been consistent and hasn't got his message of exactly 'what I'd do to fix things in Iraq'. Just my thoughts...

That was part of my point. I think he owes it to the American people to be honest about his plans. Not just 'ask for aid from our international brothers and sisters'. I think he is doing more damage to himself by not doing away with the perception by many people that he has not been consistent and hasn't got his message of exactly 'what I'd do to fix things in Iraq'. Just my thoughts...

Oh, really? Like Bush knows what he's doing, right?

This is one of the saddest posts I've seen yet. The best way to support our troops is to get them out of that QUAGMIRE. Bush is the one who created the QUAGMIRE. Kerry using the word QUAGMIRE does not make him responsible for any deaths. I have written the word QUAGMIRE in your thread four times now. What will you be responsible for?

Good show! I guess Shadow has been in the shadows too long if he thinks Kerry invented the term.

Senator Kerry isn't the first person to use the word "quagmire," nor is Iraq the first war to ever have the term applied to it. Your post is typical of the scandal hungry masses who want to read venom against America into everything the left says.

Bravo!!

Mr. Kerry how do you feel knowing that it might have been your words that emboldened these people to behead this man like they did the others.

What a ballistic cheap shot! Shame.

I bet you're a big fan of Jane Fonda too eh?

Oh, really? Like Bush knows what he's doing, right?

I didn't say either way. I think that Bush has shown and told what his plans are... for better or worse. And should continue to reveal anything new in his plans. I'm just saying that Kerry should reveal his plan. Anywho... this is completely off the topic. You might notice that my original on topic comments were that it was incorrect to try and pin the use of quagmire in the translation of the audio/video on Kerry because he used it on his own site.

I highly doubt there is an aribic word that translates exactly to quagmire.

" Oh, really? Like Bush knows what he's doing, right?"

Oh, really? Like you have any better idea than the President of the US, right?. I think it is humorous when "average joe" tries to pretend he's got the whole thing figured out and all the people in the world who have achieved positions of leadership are somehow morons. WTF do you know about what the President knows...

Kerry was a traitor in the 1970's, and he is a traitor now. He is a propaganda machine for everyone that hates the US and wants to excuse horror and violence. The last two days have shown the moral character of this "man". During a time when America needs desperately to find resolve he offers division. A whining, self-important, opportunistic malcontent, ghoulishly feeding on the bodies of beheaded hostages.

Reply #10 By: sandy2 - 9/21/2004 6:55:50 PM I highly doubt there is an aribic word that translates exactly to quagmire.

Why would you "highly doubt" that? Do you feel that Arabic isn't as highly evolved as English? Or do you think there aren't any swamps/bogs/marshes/fens/morasses in the Middle East? [/flame] Seriously, aside from the fact that any exact translation is impossible, this statement is a bit off-base.

In SATTS: MSTNQ" Pronounciation (approximate): Mu-STUN-qaeah
Once I figure out the Arabic script, I can let you know.
This was just the first one to come to mind, and means a *physical* quagmire, usually.
Link suggests also WRU? and MAE;Q for the situational quagmire. (According to my Hans Wehr, WRU? is a "difficult or critical situation ... plight ... embroilment" and MAE;Q is "narrow passageway, narrow pass, strait, bottleneck; predicament, fix, dilemma, critical situation." According to Ajeeb, "quagmire" is the first translation for MAE;Q and the 16th (of 16) for WRU?.)

what I meant is that just because the translator applied the word quagmire to the arabic word, does not mean that the speakers got that word from John Kerry or anyone else in the states using the word quagmire. For example, the word Chocar in spanish can not be translated into english in one word. If I said chocar you could say it means to hate, you could say it means to dislike, you could say it means to cause friction, etc.

sandy2 - If that's really what you meant... I can only encourage you to write what you mean next time. I can't argue with your point as you have expanded it, as it is in agreement with my stance on the issue.
I'm fully aware of the difficulties in translating between languages.

Why would you "highly doubt" that? Do you feel that Arabic isn't as highly evolved as English? Or do you think there aren't any swamps/bogs/marshes/fens/morasses in the Middle East? [/flame] Seriously, aside from the fact that any exact translation is impossible, this statement is a bit off-base.

There he is... been hoping you'd show up...